Beth's Ballot Club

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MIDTERM ELECTIONS

BETH’S BALLOT CLUB

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TRANSCRIPT

Sarah [00:00:07] This is Sarah Stewart Holland. 

Beth [00:00:08] And this is Beth Silvers.  

Sarah [00:00:10] Thank you for joining us for Pantsuit Politics.  

Beth [00:00:25] Hi, we are so glad that you're here for our new episode of Pantsuit Politics. We're going to spend a little time talking about the upcoming midterm elections today. The Senate debates have started and it feels very different than in previous cycles. So we're going to talk about all the factors that we think are influencing campaign and voter choices. And then we're going to go very local and tell you about the event that I hosted to talk with friends and neighbors about our upcoming elections. And then we'll end the show, as we always do, talking about what's on our minds Outside of Politics. And it turns out there's a lot to say about today's particular subject.  

Sarah [00:00:58] Before we jump in, we are continuing to count down to Pantsuit Politic's seventh birthday. Last week, we asked you to share seven things you learned from listening to pantsuit politics, and they were a delight to read. Just so thoughtful, so wonderful. Thank you so much to everyone who sent those lessons. And your notes, your generosity mean the world to us, and there's still time to share those reflections with us if you haven't already. Today, the challenge is-- because we're six episodes out-- we would love for you to share an episode you love with six friends. Now, listen, we all know this from our own lives, texting is the best way to share a podcast. We have not broken through, technology wise, a better way. And so a group text counts. So send an episode of Pantsuit to Politics you love to six friends. It can be a group text. Everybody loves a group text. When you complete the challenge, you can go to the link in the show notes, you can go to the link on our socials and we'll put the link on our website: Pantsuitpoliticsshow.com so you can let us know. Fill out the form that you shared it with six friends and you'll get some digital goodies, little digital party favors, and you'll be entered to win our Pantsuit Politics time capsule at the end of our birthday celebration. So thank you for joining in the birthday fun with us and as always for spending your listening time with us and sharing the show with other people because that is how we grow this community.  

Beth [00:02:21] Up next, we are going to talk about Senate races, Senate debates and our overall election malaise. It is Senate debate season!  

Sarah [00:02:38] Mm-hmm. 

Beth [00:02:38] Fewer Senate debates than we've seen in previous years and a different vibe around the debates that we are seeing. And I have to say, I'm just noticing in myself no desire to watch the full debates, which is unusual for me. And I wanted to process that with you, Sarah, what is going on, do you think?  

Sarah [00:02:56] In the past, it felt like every major Senate campaign had two to three debates. Does that feel fair? Two to three? 

Beth [00:03:04] I think that's right.  

Sarah [00:03:05] I think that sounds right. So we only have a couple that are having more than one. The second Ohio debate between Tim Ryan and J.D. Vance is happening tonight, Monday, as we record. We're going to have the Utah debate between Mike Lee and Evan McMullin tonight as well. But there is only going to be one in Georgia between Herschel Walker and Raphael Warnock. There's only going to be one in Pennsylvania between John Fetterman and Dr. Oz. There's going to be zero debates in Nevada between Cortez Masto and Laxalt. There's going to be no debates in our home state of Kentucky between Rand Paul and Charles Booker. And like you said, the debates when they're happening are a varying levels of watch ability, is what I will say, especially if you're watching the whole thing. I mean, debates are always of a kind.  They're of a kind. You have to be a certain kind of personality to want to engage with that for over an hour. But now they are so nationalized, they are so built for virality. And that's the reporting I heard on the places where there aren't debates, is the candidates are saying, "I stand to lose so much more than I stand to gain because I only had to flub it once and then it's everywhere." And you said that was your experience watching the highlights from the debate between Tim Ryan and J.D. Vance, that it was very much a play for Internet sharing and not engaging with the voters over the course of the debate.  

Beth [00:04:50] One hundred percent. And, look, I'm part of the problem because I did just watch clips. And the clips that I saw, I noticed particularly Tim Ryan-- who I think is an exceptional candidate. I would happily vote for Tim Ryan in this campaign. I think he's done a wonderful job. I have a lot to say about Tim Ryan and why I like him so much in this cycle. But in the debate, I noticed that every time he referenced J.D. Vance, he used his entire name. It felt to me like he knew that he was creating clippable videos that would function like ads for him on the Internet. And that was smart because he had a couple of moments. That's the incentive, right? That you create the moment. And he had a couple of those moments that I saw absolutely everywhere. One where he talked about how Donald Trump, campaigning for J.D. Vance, called him an ass kisser, basically humiliated him in front of his own crowd.  

Tim Ryan [00:05:45] Donald Trump said to J.D. Vance, "All you do is kiss my ass to get my support." He said that.  

Donald Trump [00:05:54] J.D is kissing my ass! He wants my support so much. I'm 18 points up. If I was 18 points down, he wouldn't want my support.  

Beth [00:06:00] And J.D. Vance went back up on stage and talked about what a great event it was, and Tim Ryan said, "I don't know anybody in my family or who I went to high school with who would have his dignity stomped on like this and continued to just stand up there with the person who did it. And that's not the kind of person we need in the United States Senate. We need someone who will take it to their own party, as I do." And that's been Tim Ryan's play the whole way. I'm a nice, normal guy who will say what I think, whether that is the party line for my party or not. It has worked on me, I will say, it has worked well.  

Sarah [00:06:36] Yeah. Well, Mark Kelly had a similar moment in his debate where he said, I told Joe Biden he was wrong about the border.  

Mike Kelly [00:06:42] Like on the border, I call him out on it because I'm always going to stick up for Arizona.  

Sarah [00:06:47] There is some distancing, again, because all of these debates feel like such nationalization. Maybe that's why nobody wants to watch them all the way through. You're going to be watching the same thing over and over again. Inflation's the reason everything's terrible. No, they're extreme on abortion, don't vote for them. It's such a reduction to the issues, both on the national stage. And I'm sure whatever issues are of top of mind for people in Pennsylvania or Arizona or Georgia, they can't all be the same. I can't believe in my heart of hearts that the people of Arizona are facing the same struggles as the people in Utah. There has to be issues. We're going to talk about this in a minute when we talk about your local gathering. But it's all the same thing. And so maybe that's why we're all watching is because it's all the same thing.  

Beth [00:07:39] It's concerning to me. I was trying to make a chart comparing Rand Paul and Charles Booker. It's almost impossible because it's like they're running on separate planets. It's not like I can line up: this is his position on climate change and this is his position. They're just not speaking the same language at this point. And I have to be honest, I'm going to vote for Charles Booker. Okay. I think Rand Paul has just become such a sideshow and such an embarrassment that I cannot vote for him again. But as I read both of their websites, the more time I really invest in this race, neither of them are saying things that feel very relevant to me to anything right now. I feel like I'm getting from Charles Booker a version of the Bernie Sanders campaign from 2016.  

Sarah [00:08:27] Yeah.  

Beth [00:08:28] And like I'm getting from Rand Paul what belongs in the pages of Breitbart. And neither of those grab me where I hear something and think that sounds actionable and pragmatic and thoughtful about the moment that we're in and I'm on board. And I think that's part of why I have so distanced from a lot of these debates, because that is not unique to these two men. I'm not blaming either of them for that. That is the environment. It is so frustrating at a time when there is so much work that has been done by the most recent Congress, like, you're running on the ability to continue some really good work that's been done, but no one's talking about that. And at a time when there's so much good work to be done, it's sitting there waiting for people to grab very real things that impact people's lives. And I just feel like it's not happening.  

Sarah [00:09:25] The election malaise, I feel, I think is reflected in the moments that do sort of bubble up through that. They're either highly personal, which is what you see in Georgia with Herschel Walker and this growing scandal that he was paying ex-girlfriends to get abortions, despite the fact that he is taking a very hard line, no exception stance in his campaign's abortion policy. Or the conversation surrounding John Fetterman in Pennsylvania as he recovers from a stroke, which I think we're going to talk about in a minute. I think that's reflective, right? That's the only thing that's bubbling up and getting our attention. Although you like Tim Ryan's ad with his wife, which was this lovely call for moderation, but it's like it's hard to break through. I think this sense of, like, what are we doing here? What is going on?  

Beth [00:10:11] I think that's why I like the Tim Ryan ad. It's called Are You Married. Why don't we just play a little bit of it?  

COMMERCIAL:

 [00:10:17] Tim Ryan: Some people think that they have to agree with their politicians 100% of the time. And I asked these people, "Are any of you married?" I love you so much.  

[00:10:27] Mrs Ryan: I love you too.  

[00:10:27] Daughter: Gross.  

[00:10:28] Son: Yes, disgusting--.  

[00:10:29] Tim Ryan: But if we have 10 conversations in one day.  

[00:10:32] Mrs Ryan: And we agree on seven.  

[00:10:33] Tim Ryan: We crack a bottle of wine.  

[00:10:34] Mrs Ryan: Yes, we do.  

[00:10:36] Tim Ryan: The same goes for the country. We have to stop the stupid fights.  

[00:10:39] Mrs Ryan: And find some common ground.  

[00:10:40] Tim Ryan: And be Americans first.  

[00:10:42] Mrs Ryan: Now, that I can agree with.  

[00:10:44] Tim Ryan: I'm Tim Ryan and I approve this message.  

Beth [00:10:46] What touches me about this is not even particularly a call for moderation, but just the grappling with how ridiculous everything is. It feels to me it's like he's breaking the fourth wall or something where he's coming through and saying, "You don't like this? You're annoyed by all of it, and so am I. And so send me normal, annoyed person like you to try to do the work and try to do a little bit better." And that did break through to me. I hate that so many campaigns have to be run on biography right now. But I agree with you, biography is really the only thing--  

Sarah [00:11:24] Only different. 

Beth [00:11:24] That find interesting because everything is so partizan and party line.  

Sarah [00:11:29] Well, and we've spoken previously that I don't even like to do campaign analysis right now. It feels weird. It feels weird that we are pretending things are normal. I was so angry at the New York Times this morning with this poll of voters are leaning Republican because they're concerned about the economy. And I'm, like, why? Why would you publish something like that right now? First of all, how about you do analysis that says while people are marching in Paris in frustration about inflation, when you even see protests in China about economic slowdowns, the global market is affecting everyone, including some voters attitude. Put that in the proper context. Instead of this traditional campaign analysis of voters trust the Republicans on the economy. Oh, you mean the Republicans right now that are anti-democratic? I don't know what to call it. I don't know what to call it any other thing. When Kari Lake says, "I'll only honor the results of the election in the Arizona gubernatorial race, if I win." If I win, then the election's valid. If I don't, then it's not valid. And that's not a stance that is unique to her. And you're out there with voters are concerned about the economy, really?  Because that does not feel like it meets the moment to me. And that's my problem with these debates, they are not meeting the moment.  

Beth [00:12:53] I think that's right. If we are in a time when people-- even people like you and me who love this-- are not going to watch an hour, hour-and-a-half-long Senate debate because it is being made for clips, find a new format.  

Sarah [00:13:08] Yeah.  

Beth [00:13:09] There has to be a way to not give up on information from these candidates. That's what I think is happening. I think that all of that horserace analysis is what we're getting because there's nothing else to cover.  

Sarah [00:13:22] Yeah.  

Beth [00:13:23] The campaign stops are just show now. Only the hardcore faithful show up to be fed the lines that they wanted to hear and that are the same thing that people are tweeting. Even questions that journalists are trying to ask, candidates are have become so good at saying, "If I don't like the question, well, the media sucks. It's not that I don't have an answer. It's that your question comes from a place of bias, so I don't have to answer it." There's just no substance whatsoever being delivered. And that means, to me, we've got to find some new delivery mechanisms.  

Sarah [00:14:00] One of the newsletters I read was talking about the TikTok-ization of other social media platforms and the Internet as a whole, that it's not just these clips that we're hungry for. I don't even know if we're hungry for them, but that's what's the market is rewarding right now. Are these short video formats and so the other media platforms are adopting them. And it's like we're also seeing this like TikTok-ization of campaigns, right? But the problem with TikTok is not just the short form video. The problem is that is detached from social content. So it's not even short term video from your friends and family, it is short term video from someone who is desperate to go viral. And that's what it feels like in the campaigns right now. The reason they can't do coverage of policy because there isn't policy on particularly the Republican side. There is no policy analysis. There is no policy platform. It's just, again, this sort of anti-democratic fervor, this fear mongering, as if the United States is the only place in the globe experiencing inflation and economic woes. And it's just so frustrating to me, even when what bubbles up is important. I think the conversation surrounding John Fetterman and his recovery from a stroke and these auditory processing issues he's clearly having is really, really, important and impactful, and will expand the understanding and the empathy people feel for someone going through a complex medical event. And I hope that whatever the result of that election, John Fetterman knows that. I think that is true. I think it might ultimately be that it's a bridge too far and people aren't there and they'll still struggle to vote for someone that is having those issues. But no matter how they vote, they have now gained additional understanding and information about what happens when someone goes through something like this. And that is incredible and that is impactful and still it's getting lost and still it feels like even in these places. I think the conversation in Utah between Mike Lee and Evan McMullin is interesting. It's still is like swimming against the tide to put the proper emphasis on places where important things are happening inside these campaigns.  

Beth [00:16:21] And some of that, I think, comes from the fact that the opportunities candidates have to communicate with us are so detached from the jobs that we need them to do as senators. It probably would be better to have a reverse debate like where we see we take a policy to someone who wants to be a senator and say, "What questions do you have about this? Here's a doctor. Will you ask some questions of this doctor to get to the bottom of whatever this health care policy is? Because that's really your job. Not to be so conversant on everything, but to be a lifelong learner, someone who is curious and probative and who is really interested in getting to the heart of the matter. Let's watch you do that." I'd watch people ask questions all day instead of give us some speech. I think that would be a fabulous way to evolve what we are getting from these candidates.  

Sarah [00:17:14] Because we're not getting much right now. I think you're right. I think just like every other area of American life, we came through the pandemic and we said the institutions were already struggling, if not crumbling. And this has accelerated the path and the pace of transition.  And that's what's happening right now with campaigns. We're stuck in this messy middle. We are transitioning from what was to what will be. And we are really, really, exposing in experience the limits of what was because it is past. You watch these debates and you're like, well, that's yesterday. That's no longer applicable. And so we have to evolve and we're going to have to figure this out. And the campaigns that that well, the media outlets who understand that and do it well, well, they're the ones that are going to thrive.  

Beth [00:18:12] I'm reading this fabulous book called From Reopen to Reinvent. It's by Michael Horn. And it's a it's about recreating schools for every child. That's the subheading, recreating schools for every child. And he puts it so perfectly that schools are expending enormous energy and resources to get back to a normal that was not working for anyone. [Crosstalk]. And I think that that is so relevant in so many contexts, and especially here. Enormous amounts of money, obscene amounts of money are being spent to do these races and for who?  

Sarah [00:18:50] Yeah.  

Beth [00:18:50] What is the benefit? I get the raw political calculus that these seats are so important. As a matter of party line votes, sometimes they are. I don't want to be naive about that. Sometimes just having the numbers is really important. It certainly matters to control of committees and control of what legislation gets brought to the floor. So I'm not trying to be Pollyanna about this. At the same time, that is not working for us in terms of engaging people more effectively in civic dialog. And so how can we innovate? That's the question I'd like to focus on.  

Sarah [00:19:30] Well, I think what you did this weekend was a form of innovation. I think we should talk about that.  

Beth [00:19:46] On Saturday night, I had 23 women come to my house, which I think is amazing to get 23 women together in a week's time in October on a Saturday night.  

Sarah [00:19:55] That is huge. That is a big number.  

Beth [00:19:58] And we just went through our local ballot. I called it ballot club like a book club, except for the text is the ballot. So my neighbor, Susan, printed out the sample ballot for everyone. I spent a few hours making a Google Slides presentation to just show every single race, and I put links in it so that afterward people could check out campaign websites or whatever. And I said to people, "Come bring friends. I don't care who you bring or how many people." I invited a very wide group of people in terms of who cares about politics and who doesn't. Party affiliations. Lots of people I knew nothing about, how they felt about any of this. I just kind of wanted to say these local races are important. I always get to city council and have no idea who to vote for because, again, not a lot of communication happening about who these folks are and what they care about. So let's all get in a room and see who we know and what we know and share information. And it was a really wonderful evening, I thought.  

Sarah [00:21:05] So how long did you meet? For how long did the event last for?  

Beth [00:21:08] So it started at eight. The last people left my house at like ten to midnight.  

Sarah [00:21:12] Whew!  

Beth [00:21:13] There was a lot of just chatting and having food before we actually started talking it through. And then it took us a little over 2 hours to get through the ballot because there's a lot on the ballot this time. We started at the Senate race, the Booker versus Paul race, and we ended at the mayor of union.  

Sarah [00:21:30] Wow!  

Beth [00:21:32] It was a long time. We went through coroner and everything.  

Sarah [00:21:34] Did you spend more time on the national races or on the local races?  

Beth [00:21:37] On the local races for sure.  

Sarah [00:21:39] Okay, that's good.  

Beth [00:21:41] The national races-- and I basically said in that event what I said in our first segment here, it's like there's nothing to compare with these candidates. If you are on the fence about these races, I don't know how because they're just talking about totally different things.  

Sarah [00:21:57] But how much did that trickle down? There's so much nationalization in the local races, especially around abortion. How did you work through that as a group?  

Beth [00:22:06] I think one of the most obvious results of having this discussion was seeing how everyone is frustrated that our races are decided in primaries at a county level, that we have so many people running unopposed, that people don't even have campaign websites, some of them don't even have Facebook pages where you can find out about them. There are people who don't have signs up. They don't have to run if they get through the primary.  

Sarah [00:22:37] And that's like another form of anti-democratic process, right? That is anti-democratic. And when you have places like that--  let's pretend this person on the ballot is, like, the 2020 election was real and I honor the results of the election. Still there's this anti-democratic background if you're not ever being challenged.  

Beth [00:23:01]  One hundred percent. One person said it really well. That however you view any particular issue, you have to be disappointed when you see how few choices are on this ballot and how many people are running unopposed. So with those races, we talked a lot about what is this job? What is the county clerk? What is that person doing? What does the PVA do? Because how can we get people to run if we don't understand the jobs?  

Sarah [00:23:25] Right.  

Beth [00:23:26] We were fortunate to have some people with quite a bit of experience working with local government to be able to add some complexion to those jobs. But at one point somebody was just like, "Are we forming a PAC right now? Is that what's happening?" Because everybody was kind of, like, "No, that's unacceptable." It's just unacceptable that we have so many people. And local government jobs are jobs. They're really good jobs. And so if you have a very small group of people, and in our case, a very small group of people with a pretty extreme ideology running away with these really nice jobs, that is not democracy. And we got to pay more attention to have something that feels more functional. Even the folks who do a good job. And we had folks who everybody in the room was, like, "I probably don't agree with this person about much, but they're very responsive, they're reliable, they show up to the meetings, they do the things." Great. That's fine. Still they should have to run a campaign.  

Sarah [00:24:27]  Yeah. So what was the vibe for the people who had been not as politically involved over time? Were they showing up at their first ballot club,like, engaging really for the first time?  

Beth [00:24:41] I think there were a number of people who didn't say much of anything, but as they were leaving, they were, like, I learned so much. I noticed that lots of people had written all over the sample ballot, like, taken a bunch of notes, made decisions about what they were going to do on different races. We had a really good discussion of Amendment One. So we have two constitutional amendments on our ballot in Kentucky. One of them is the bodily autonomy amendment that we talked about in the episode about abortion. But the other is about whether our Republican supermajority legislator can call itself into special session. They want to amend the Constitution so that they can call themselves into special session instead of relying on our Democratic governor to do it. I'm not kidding, it runs the entire length of the page. It is so long. It is so confusing. You read it and you have no idea what it's about. So we had a really good discussion of that amendment, just helping everybody understand what it means and why it's on our ballot.  

Sarah [00:25:39] Well, and not for nothing, I think their strategy backfires on them, because I think a voter gets in there and is, like, "I don't understand this, so I'm just going to vote no." When you try to make it confusing, I think sometimes it backfires and I think people are just, like, "Forget it, no. I don't even understand what you're asking me."  

Beth [00:25:54] I hope that's right. I told my mom, when in doubt, vote no on a constitutional right. There's a chance to bring it back up if it's a good idea. But if it gets in there, it gets very difficult to change it.  

Sarah [00:26:05] You know, what I told somebody is I would love for our legislator to be full time. I would love for them to be there more working, but not this way. Because this isn't about you wanting to work more. This is you wanting to grab more power from the governor because you won't honor the results of the election and the voters who empowered our Democratic Governor, Andy Beshear, to make decisions. You won't honor the power of the people who voted for him. It's the same thing you see in North Carolina, right? Like in other states where you just there is no respect or honoring the power of the people. And that's what I love about this event. Like, this is it, right? This is it. And the reason you're upset, you should be, because that is power being taken away from the people. Our democratic process is built on the foundation that the power does not come from the top, it comes from the bottom, it comes from the voter. And when you feel that power being taken away from you because there's no choice, because they're not having the campaign, then they're using power they did not earn. They are claiming power that they did not earn. And I think that that people are right to be frustrated. And you don't have to be engaged with politics to sort of feel that frustration.  

Beth [00:27:11] I think that's right. And it was nice to see people frustrated about the right things. There wasn't any moment where it felt hard, like, oh, we're getting into a thorny issue where people might disagree. 

Sarah [00:27:21] Really? Even around the constitutional amendment on abortion?  

Beth [00:27:24] That's right. Because the conversation in the room was really about understanding what are these offices? Who are these people? What does this amendment actually say? Do I get it? That was where the conversation stayed focused. And around most of the offices, people just wanted to know, like, can this person do the job? Are they qualified? If they've been doing it, have they done it well? We had lawyers in the room. Our Supreme Court race that's coming up, the lawyers in the room were able to say, like, "This person hasn't really practiced law." They had looked up public records to see how many cases this person had appeared on. It was like five. They were saying, "This guy is running for Supreme Court justice and he hasn't even really practiced law." So and the room's, like, okay. And it doesn't even matter beyond that. People want competence. And we were able to get to who out there is competent to do the positions that they're seeking.  

Sarah [00:28:20] I love that. So you left empowered. You left happy with your ballot club?  

Beth [00:28:26] A hundred percent. I would do it again. I told everybody in the room, "I would love for you to take this slideshow, take these sample ballots, host your own, then you can use my house. I'll make snacks for your friends."  I just want to do more of this. I'd be happy to host a meet the candidate situation. I think what was empowering about it is that no one was asked for anything other than to think together. No one was asked for money. No one was asked to mail postcards or put up yard signs. They were just asked to think about this, and that created a lot of good energy. So I would 100% do it again. It's also, to me, so much better than trying to do this on Facebook or something. Every year I post as much information as I can about local races on Facebook. It is a totally different thing to have people in a room together, even people who don't know each other well, just saying what do we care about in our community? And who are these people who want to lead it?  

Sarah [00:29:21] I love that so much. Well, I think this is exactly the type of innovation you were talking about. And I hope when people go to these events-- and I think some of our listeners are already hosting their own and planning these around their communities, I'm brainstorming my own here in Paducah-- that it starts the process of what are we doing here? The question we were asking in the first segment, what are we doing here? What's the point? What's the point of this position? What are we looking for in a candidate? How do we get better candidates? How do we make this process do what we want it to do? But just first we have to ask, what do we want? And I think that sitting together with your fellow community members and asking that question is incredibly important.  

Beth [00:30:06] I would encourage anyone to do it. I'm not going to say it was easy. There was definitely a moment where I thought, oh, I feel very vulnerable right now and very nervous about making sure that everybody leaves feeling good and empowered. But you just push through it and get to the why. Why are we here? We really are here just because we all want the best community we can have. And we all want to show up and vote based on something other than the signs that we saw. I mean, everybody really wants-- people take voting seriously.  

Sarah [00:30:39] Yeah.  

Beth [00:30:39] I think that's part of what has rubbed me so wrong about campaign analysis in this cycle. That the tandem to politicians are creating virality is that voters are being talked about and treated as consumers. And that is not what anybody wants. And so any place we can find where we say, "No, we're not consumers, we're citizens, and we take it seriously. And so let's invest in that process," it felt really good to me. Well, Sarah, we always end with what's on our minds Outside of Politics. And we've been discussing for a while perhaps sharing with people what's in our purses. And then we talked about how maybe we shouldn't discuss what's in our purses. Maybe that's a little too feminine, but I don't think so. I feel like everybody's carrying a bag now and I like it. I think that's important. So I would love to know what's in your bag.  

Sarah [00:31:38] Truly, my husband is a gearhead. Everybody knows this. And he has now procured-- I mean, I don't know what to call it. It's not a purse because it doesn't have straps, but it's like a little pouch that holds his everyday carry flashlight, his everyday carry pen, his everyday carry little notebook, and of course, his everyday carry knife because my husband is a pocket knife aficionado. And I thought, oh, you're getting the appeal of this because what is a purse except for an everyday carry?  

Beth [00:32:10] That's right.  

Sarah [00:32:12] So I, in my middle age, have abandoned heavy purses. Do I have some in my closet because I can't bear to get rid of them because they're so beautiful? Yes. But do I carry them? No. I keep my purses really small, usually a crossbody. And so there's not a lot in my purse. I bought a purse in Paris and I'm loving and caring right now. And it has a checkbook, a wallet, a small mirror, two lipsticks-- but on is a little one that I got from my Advent Calendar. That was the best part of my lipstick Advent Calendar last year, is they're these little baby lipsticks. And then, of course, because I am the mother of a type one diabetic, Mega Smarties to address low blood sugars. And I think I have a little hairbrush. I think that's it. It's a tight operation, is what I'm saying. It's a very tight operation inside my purse.  

Beth [00:33:03] So I'm the opposite end of the spectrum. I like a really big bag and I like lots of little bags within my really big bag.  

Sarah [00:33:09] But does it not hurt your back? It hurts my back so bad.  

Beth [00:33:12] It really doesn't. I think that one of the gifts of yoga for me is that I have really good posture and I really pay attention to how I carry a purse. And so I really think about where it sits on my shoulders. If it starts to bother me, I know I need to kind of adjust the position of my body. It's not like I'm out carrying a purse far very often.  

Sarah [00:33:29] True.   

Beth [00:33:31] But I only carry a little purse when we travel. And every time I cannot wait to get back to my big purse because I just feel like I don't have everything.  

Sarah [00:33:38] It's so funny we're the opposite. I increase my purse size when I travel. I usually have a beautiful leather backpack from ABLE, our new partner, that I'm loving. And I do carry more when I travel. I shrink my wallet size, but I carry more things. But it's the opposite. I know it's always funny to me because I see you when you're traveling you have this little thing, I'm like, "Don't you need more things? We don't have our house. We don't have our car." Because the truth is, my car is my purse. That's where I keep the things like all the Band-Aids, and the additional socks, and all the things I need; they're in my car, because I always have my van. 

Beth [00:34:11] I carry a backpack when we travel and I put a little purse inside it so that I don't have to take the backpack everywhere that we're going when we're out and about. But I can have all my plain stuff together. But I like my big bag because I just feel like I always have what someone might need.  

Sarah [00:34:25] It's an Enneagram two energy.  

Beth [00:34:25]  It is. I have lotion, if somebody needs lotion. I carry this to-go office card that has a teeny, tiny stapler, and teeny tiny scissors, and little post-it notes, and a pen, and it all velcroes on. So it stays together, which is so nice. I usually have peppermint essential oil somewhere. I've always have a variety of gums and mints. I just want to make sure that we all have what we need when we're out and about. I keep a notebook in there always, because you just never know.  

Sarah [00:34:50] Well, this is, again, personality test. I value efficiency so much and I slim it down and I slim it down. And I just depend on, I guess, you because you've trained me that you will have what I need or I can buy what I need or someone will have what I need. And I'd rather just deal with it in the moment, like, needing something than carry it. I do not like schlepping. My back starts hurting really easily and quickly if I'm carrying around a lot of stuff and I do the same thing. This weekend I went out of town and I had to ask for like three different things from people because despite the fact that we travel so regularly, I'm constantly, consistently forgetting things because I want to keep it so tight. I really need to find a better balance, I guess. But the purse situation I usually have-- I think that's the other thing, is like I would keep those things and then they would just never get used. They would sit and I would never use them. And nobody was asking me for things beyond a Band-Aid-- because I have three boys. Oh, I will say this. Actually, I forgot about this. I do have in my purse. Have you seen the little thing, (it went around TikTok) tt's like one of those jelly balls-- I don't know what it tells to call it-- inside like a little plastic cage and it rolls around the bottom of your purse collects dust and debris.  

Beth [00:36:06] No, but I need that. I'll get that.  

Sarah [00:36:08] It's amazing. It works. It's one of the very few things I've bought on TikTok that I thought, this is everything that was promised to me. And we will put links in the show notes if you want.  

Beth [00:36:16] Yeah, I want that.  

Sarah [00:36:16] It's amazing how well it does. And then you just rinse it off. You just take it out of its little plastic cage and you rinse it off, and put it back in there and it rolls around and it collects all the gunk. You know what I mean?  

Beth [00:36:28] I for sure want that.  

Sarah [00:36:29] Even when I have a tiny purse, I keep it in there.  

Beth [00:36:32] I think it's so funny that no one ask you for things. I feel like people need things from my purse constantly. I was at a concert once. This was like peak for me. Actually, this has happened several times where I'm around someone and someone spill something and I always have like wet wipes in my purse or at least a little wipes from the airlines. And I just feel so good when I'm able to be, like, "Here you go, we can take care of that. No worries."  

Sarah [00:36:53] The only thing I've gotten better about having-- but I have one in my van, so I don't keep one in my purse but I do always have one when I travel-- is fingernail clippers. That's the thing I feel like I always need. And for years as we traveled, I never had a fingernail clipper  [Inaudible] figured that situation out, but no I don't know. It's like this is a personality type too. Even when I was a city commissioner, I used to get so upset because people would call the other female city commissioner for something. And I'm, like, "Why doesn't anybody ask me for anything." I guess I put up a vibe that's, like, you're an adult, deal with your own problems.  

Beth [00:37:23] You're on your own. I have learned to pack extra sunglasses just in case you have forgotten yours when you're traveling. The other thing I need to get for you when we travel is a sewing kit because you always need a sewing kit.   

Sarah [00:37:32] Well, no, I kept that one from last time. The last time I had to sew a button on I stuck it in my bag. I've gotten better about realizing what I need. And my husband packed me an every day podcast carrier. Y'all, that is the cutest thing you've ever seen. It's like every charger I need, a very fancy Sharpie to sign books, a travel microphone, and a bottle of Excedrin Migrain. So he put it all together for me. So I have my little podcast every day carry that I take when we travel. But I've learned that from him. Just figure out the things you're always needing and put them in something you pack every time. And I've gotten better at that. I've gotten a lot better at that. Lord, who knew you could talk so much about purses and traveling?  

Beth [00:38:09] This is what I'm saying. There's a lot to what you are going to haul around with you in the world every day. And I am at a much lighter situation now that my kids are older. When they were little, I always had crayons and cheerios and a board book because you just never know where you're going to get stuck, and you've got to have all the things to make it through whatever time you need them to hang in through.  

Sarah [00:38:31] That's so true. It's so true.  

Beth [00:38:32] Well, thank you all so much for joining us for our wide ranging conversations every episode. We know that we're always having discussions here that cannot contain everyone's experience, so we love getting the conversation started here on the show and then continuing it with you. You can talk with other listeners in our premium community and on social media. You can always email us Hello@Pantsuitpoliticsshow.com, we read every message. We so appreciate your thoughts. I particularly would love to hear how you're taking in these midterm races and what level of engagement you have and if you have valid clubs. We very much want to hear about those. We'll be back with you on Friday. Everybody have the best week available to you.  

[00:39:26] Pantsuit Politics is produced by Studio D Podcast Production. Alise Napp is our managing director.  

Sarah [00:39:31] Maggie Penton is our community engagement manager. Dante Lima is the composer and performer of our theme music.  

Beth [00:39:37] Our show is listener-supported. Special thanks to our executive producers.  

Executive Producers (Read their own names) [00:39:41] Martha Bronitsky. Linda Daniel. Allie Edwards. Janice Elliott. Sarah Greenup. Julie Haller. Helen Handly. Tiffany Hassler, Emily Holliday, Katie Johnson. Katina Zugenalis Kasling. Barry Kaufman. Molly Kohrs. Laurie LaDowl. Lily McClure. Emily Neesley. Tawni Peterson. Tracy Puthof. Sarah Ralph. Jeremy Sequoia. Katie Stiggers. Karen True. Onica Ulveling. Nick and Alysa Villeli. Katherine Vollmer. Amy Whited.  

Beth [00:40:16] Jeff Davis. Melinda Johnston. Michelle Wood. Joshua Allen. Morgan McCue. Nichole Berklas. Paula Bremer and Tim Miller.  

[00:40:28]   





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